(12-01-2016, 02:27 AM)syscrash Wrote: We know Juliette did not hate Nick or she would not have said she was sorry about his mother. And asked for him to kill her.
Hi Syscrash,
Can you point out the scene(s) where Juliette told nick she was sorry about his mother?
N G
At the end of cry havoc when she delivered this line "I didn't know Kenneth was gonna do that." she was showing remorse.
she followed that with
Nick: She trusted you.
Juliette: I know. I thought they just wanted Diana.
Nick: You betrayed her! [He grabs her and pins her against a wall to choke her]
Juliette: [Gasping] Do it, Nick. Kill me. Just do it. Do it.
other then an admission of remorse what could have been the purpose of the statement. That it was said with emotion prevents it from being meant to torment Nick.
Just after that her entire affect changed. Gone was the remorse.
[She gasps more. Nick lets go of her and she catches her breath] You can't put me out of your misery, huh? I hope you're not going to tell me you're still in love with me.
Nick: Get out.
Juliette: After everything I've done for you, you think that's how we're gonna end it? You should have killed me when you had the chance. [She woges and pushes Nick across the room into a wall. Then, she throws him part way through a window, drags him back, and smacks him across his face. She retracts and looks at Nick on the ground]
This shows the stark contrast between the Juliette personality and the Hexenbiest that Juliette was becoming.
12-01-2016, 06:17 PM (This post was last modified: 12-01-2016, 06:50 PM by Purity.)
(12-01-2016, 04:37 PM)syscrash Wrote: At the end of cry havoc when she delivered this line "I didn't know Kenneth was gonna do that." she was showing remorse.
she followed that with
Nick: She trusted you.
Juliette: I know. I thought they just wanted Diana.
Nick: You betrayed her! [He grabs her and pins her against a wall to choke her]
Juliette: [Gasping] Do it, Nick. Kill me. Just do it. Do it.
other then an admission of remorse what could have been the purpose of the statement. That it was said with emotion prevents it from being meant to torment Nick.
Just after that her entire affect changed. Gone was the remorse.
[She gasps more. Nick lets go of her and she catches her breath] You can't put me out of your misery, huh? I hope you're not going to tell me you're still in love with me.
Nick: Get out.
Juliette: After everything I've done for you, you think that's how we're gonna end it? You should have killed me when you had the chance. [She woges and pushes Nick across the room into a wall. Then, she throws him part way through a window, drags him back, and smacks him across his face. She retracts and looks at Nick on the ground]
This shows the stark contrast between the Juliette personality and the Hexenbiest that Juliette was becoming.
I think you missed the point in this act, .... it had nothing to do with Hexenbiest side effects, A Hexen B. side does not show remorse a.k.a Eve. This was all Juliette side.
This is how I understood this part ... Yes she felt remorse as Juliette, she did not apologise, Nick angry, tried to chock her as she wanted him to kill her. But Nick did what next, he stopped and then stepped back....
Now, imagine how much more guilt poured in to her (very mind blowing), when she understood nick was not going to do anything physical or kill her. The guilt was just to much to bare, so she began to taunt him to try to get him to react and still he did nothing.
Since she has gone this far allowing her dark side take over, why not go an extra mile to just kill him.
12-01-2016, 09:21 PM (This post was last modified: 12-01-2016, 09:58 PM by irukandji.)
(12-01-2016, 01:58 AM)Purity Wrote: Adalind was just a pawn within the show he ran.
She did not succeed to kill his Aunt, and yes granted, but she was a villian (expected to be) who trully did not know what she was really getting into because she thought she was doing this for Renards false love.
I'm curious because this isn't the first time I've seen the word, "pawn", attributed to Adalind. And so, my question:
If Adaind is indeed a pawn, then is she so stupid she doesn't know what's going on around her?
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12-01-2016, 10:20 PM (This post was last modified: 12-01-2016, 10:21 PM by Purity.)
(12-01-2016, 09:21 PM)irukandji Wrote:
(12-01-2016, 01:58 AM)Purity Wrote: Adalind was just a pawn within the show he ran.
She did not succeed to kill his Aunt, and yes granted, but she was a villian (expected to be) who trully did not know what she was really getting into because she thought she was doing this for Renards false love.
I'm curious because this isn't the first time I've seen the word, "pawn", attributed to Adalind. And so, my question:
If Adaind is indeed a pawn, then is she so stupid she doesn't know what's going on around her?
Well, Renard is known to use people to do his bidings. With Adalind, I do not think she was stupid to fall for it, I beleive there were 3 factors here...
1. She thought she would have a future with Renard.
2. It seemed she was still a novice playing Renard's game and back fired when it all fell apart.
3. To also please her mother.
Didn't Catherine owe Sean and somehow roped Adalind into working with/for Sean to cancel a debt? Adalind thought she was in love with him so she would have done anything to please him. She stopped being his "pawn" when both mother and lover rejected her after she lost her powers. I don't think being a pawn makes one stupid, it's just a indicator of one's vulnerability to the person pulling the strings whether they are aware of it or not.
At first it did seem that Adalind was a pawn of Sean's. When Adalind started working for Eric. Sean became a pawn of Adalind's. That was the time when Sean and Adalind became enemies. It was also when she seduced Sean to conceive Dianna. And to think this was after she had lost her powers. Sean was also weakened because he was dealing with the compulsion spell. But of all the times. This time she was especially vicious with an extremely bad attitude.
12-02-2016, 06:01 AM (This post was last modified: 12-02-2016, 06:16 AM by irukandji.)
Correct me if I'm wrong here. I get the impression that Adalind is being called a pawn to somehow lessen or even remove her culpability for her actions. For instance, Marie's murder. Adalind had nothing against Marie, but she so desperately loved Sean that she would do anything for him. Aside from that, she didn't really murder Marie anyway because Nick prevented her from doing so. So in the end, Adalind really isn't so bad because she's doing it for love.
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12-02-2016, 07:14 AM (This post was last modified: 12-02-2016, 01:02 PM by Hell Rell.)
The truth of the matter is Adalind was a pawn. Marie's murder was prevented by Nick so it does affect the perception of what happened there. It was also the pilot episode so the attachment to the characters wasn't near what it is now so that also has an effect.
I think some viewers are probably a bit soft on Adalind due to the way CC played her with vulnerability even when she was playing the villain. The man she was in love with and her mother were using her from the start so it didn't seem like she was doing it for the thrills despite being a hexenbiest. The fact that she didn't succeed in killing Marie or get the key kind of set the precedent for her being this bumbling antagonist who was way in over her head. In a way, Juliette's effectiveness as a villain in getting results is what caused more vitriol to come her way.
Another factor in the way Adalind is received by some is Renard. Adalind being blamed for all of the awful things that happened to Nick and by extension his friends is fair but it seems unfair when it falls solely on her. Renard was the one pulling the strings from the start and he was the reason Nick got on Adalind's radar. I've been around this fandom long enough to know that Renard gets more of a pass than anyone in this show. It almost seems like the writers themselves completely absolved him midway through season 2 and he became a reliable ally. I see the problem more as Renard getting too much of a pass because it has the direct effect of people coming to the defense of Adalind.
She would not have messed with Marie if it had not been for Sean.She knew there was a grimm in Portland when she saw Nick ,Sean knew Adalind's mother very well .That was the connection.He should have called Catherine.
And Sean with the idea of annoying Hank-wanted the key.-.Sean told her when she lost her hexenbiest side that was just another pretty face.She seduced both brothers and settled with the two,I think it would be to be more sure of getting pregnant.Was not a hexenbiest nor acted under the influence.Your fear of becoming hexenbiest for me is false-
she mature.I also think that Nick would be afraid to lose control as I happened to be a zombie