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+--- Thread: Eve/Juliette (/Thread-Eve-Juliette)
RE: Eve/Juliette - Robyn - 02-28-2018
I’ve been thinking about the Nick/Juliette relationship issues compared to the other characters’ uncomplicated acceptance of their role in Nick’s Grimm life. Hank and Wu as cops saw Nick’s Grimm side as a superior defense/offense against Wesen criminals/combatants. Grimm and Wesen were a natural part of Monroe and Rosalee’s life, so once they reconciled with befriending a Grimm, working with Nick wasn’t strange. The same with Adalind, she and Nick understood and related to one another on a level that the human Juliette, who initially assumed she and Nick would marry and raise their children in a typically normal lifestyle, couldn’t.
Nick being a Grimm didn’t disrupt the lives of the other characters in a profound way, but it gave doubt to everything Juliette thought her life would be. Someone posted recently that Juliette turning down Nick’s proposal was one of the most normal things she did. I agree, Juliette had no idea what was actually going on in her boyfriend’s life and reacted as any normal human would. What I found strange for the character was that she didn’t take time away from Nick to figure out what she could and couldn’t live without - Nick or having a normal relationship and raising a family in a normal & safe lifestyle.
But. Juliette did eventually decide what she wanted after becoming a Hexenbiest and learning to control it - and it wasn’t Nick. So I wonder if Juliette always knew, at least on some level, that she didn’t want to marry Nick and raise a family in the Grimm lifestyle but wasn’t emotionally strong enough to walk away. Or. Was Juliette content to forego marriage and family because she needed/wanted Nick more, and only told Nick their time had passed because the Hexenbiest tragedy and him having a child with someone else was too much of an obstacle?
RE: Eve/Juliette - Hell Rell - 02-28-2018
(02-28-2018, 05:12 AM)irukandji Wrote: I wouldn't say what we saw between Nick and Juliette constitutes devotion on his part. If that was the case, there wouldn't have been so many posts voicing such irritation with Juliette, and to a lesser extent, Nick himself. After all, if it's obvious there are some people here who really are smitten with him as the main character and feel he generally makes the right decision. So why would decisions in his love life be subject to scrutiny then? If he truly loved her, then I believe most viewers would go along with that, even if her love for Nick in return was not on the same level.
Nick, to me, is just one of those guys who wants a woman in his life, but just isn't capable of having the depth of maturity to show her that she's the one who's a priority to him. I could see them squabbling, Juliette questioning his love for her, and Nick responding by saying, "well, I took on you on that romantic weekend...........er, uh four years ago, right? Remember? I even proposed.
Look, what more do you want?"
Fair or unfair, the love interest will receive the most ire most of the time and the main character will constantly be questioned on why they're with them or interested in them at all. It happens in just about every show I watch. The Flash gets questioned on several forums about being with Iris and Green Arrow being with Felicity is in a whole other stratosphere.
Loving one character doesn't constitute liking their LI. People have different reasons for disliking Juliette and her relationship with Nick might even add to the reasons they don't like her. A character's love life is often the messiest part of their profile especially for a fantasy show. The LI usually is looked at as ruining the fun. Sometimes, the show will try to rectify this and make them more involved in the main storyline which further irritates viewers because that takes away time from the main character by placing more importance on their partner. Check out the Lana is a witch storyline from Smallville to see how awful this can be and how much fandom will hate it and I say that as someone who likes Lana.
Nick loving Juliette or Adalind would never protect them or him from being scrutinized. I think it happens for several reasons like the above but I find that it usually includes writers not being good at writing romance or what is perceived to be a lack of chemistry. The chemistry aspect can't be argued because it's a lot more subjective than the writing one because that can be analyzed.
RE: Eve/Juliette - Robyn - 02-28-2018
Hell Rell, that’s a really good summation of the difficulties shows, writers, and characters face with on-going love interests for the central character. My first thought was that a rarely seen love interest who doesn’t do much would be the least complicated approach, but, I took issue with Adalind’s limit role as Nick’s love interest prior to her going to BC with Kelly. So I guess there’s no easy way to write a love interest that’s accepted by viewers overall.
RE: Eve/Juliette - Hell Rell - 02-28-2018
I wouldn't how to do it myself. The LI that isn't seen much probably is the best wat to approach it.
It's usually woman that suffer but men aren't exempt. I think Mon-El on Supergirl irritates me more than any of the others currently. He's actually a hero in his own right but he still sucks. I find the show to be very enjoyable but he's a drag whenever he's on screen. It goes further than that because it's also a drag whenever he's talked about even when he's not on screen.
I think Rosalee would be liked at much differently had she become Nick's GF at some point on the show. Being paired with Monroe was better for her than being paired with Nick. Personally, I like Rosalee more than MonRosalee which I could take or leave for the most part.
RE: Eve/Juliette - irukandji - 03-01-2018
(02-28-2018, 07:14 AM)Hell Rell Wrote: Fair or unfair, the love interest will receive the most ire most of the time and the main character will constantly be questioned on why they're with them or interested in them at all. It happens in just about every show I watch. The Flash gets questioned on several forums about being with Iris and Green Arrow being with Felicity is in a whole other stratosphere.
Loving one character doesn't constitute liking their LI. People have different reasons for disliking Juliette and her relationship with Nick might even add to the reasons they don't like her. A character's love life is often the messiest part of their profile especially for a fantasy show. The LI usually is looked at as ruining the fun. Sometimes, the show will try to rectify this and make them more involved in the main storyline which further irritates viewers because that takes away time from the main character by placing more importance on their partner. Check out the Lana is a witch storyline from Smallville to see how awful this can be and how much fandom will hate it and I say that as someone who likes Lana.
Nick loving Juliette or Adalind would never protect them or him from being scrutinized. I think it happens for several reasons like the above but I find that it usually includes writers not being good at writing romance or what is perceived to be a lack of chemistry. The chemistry aspect can't be argued because it's a lot more subjective than the writing one because that can be analyzed.
Unfortunately I don't watch the Flash or Arrow, and I got really bored with Smallville after about the third season, so I'm not familiar with any of these relationships. In my opinion, from a science fiction/fantasy perspective, I think I prefer a main character who, because he is different and thus has an extremely dangerous life, shuns away from a significant other or any attempt at a normal life.
I agree Nick and Juliette had little chemistry as a romantic couple. Nick and Adalind had even less. The creative team shouldn't have heaped relationships on him. He's got his job, the side story intrigues, an occasional fling to make sure he's shown as desirable, and the scoobies. Adding a significant other to than just makes Nick seem piggish in my opinion.
RE: Eve/Juliette - Robyn - 03-01-2018
I know the show used Nick/Juliette as a way to keep Nick grounded and present him as that different kind of Grimm with a strong support group. However, I can’t help but wonder if it might have worked better had one of them ended the relationship or Juliette died in the first or second season. Nick would have still had the support of his friends and a solid source for woe-is-me heartache, but without continuing a relationship with irresolvable issues.
By the time Nick and Juliette were still playing around with the engagement ring and proposal in S3, I was begging the writers to stick a fork in it. Whether living together or married, they would still have the same unresolved issues until accepting there wasn’t a lifestyle that would allow both to be happy.
RE: Eve/Juliette - Hell Rell - 03-01-2018
Nick and Juliette sticking with each other after season 1 was hard to swallow but being together past season 2 was all types of ridiculous.
Both of them were delusional. Nick should've ended the relationship after the cat-scratch fever. Not because of Juliette, but because of him being who he is is why Juliette went through this horrible experience and this is after being kidnapped by a Damonfeuer and the house being invaded by a Siegbarste. He should've forgot about what he wanted and did what was beat for Juliette's safety.
As for Juliette, she should've decided to leave on her own after knowing the truth. She was attacked several times and her life was put in danger without knowing why. Nick had been lying to her for over a year and still didn't tell her the truth outside of a life-threatening situation. It was Monroe, Rosalee, and Bud who helped her learn about the world. The confusion alone should been enough for her to call it quits.
It also doesn't help that I've never been a fan of "love conquers all" storylines. It just makes the characters look absurd unless the show makes a point of showing how absurd they are. There were too many obstacles, danger, and lies for their relationship to last.
RE: Eve/Juliette - thecdn - 03-01-2018
(03-01-2018, 05:23 AM)irukandji Wrote: In my opinion, from a science fiction/fantasy perspective, I think I prefer a main character who, because he is different and thus has an extremely dangerous life, shuns away from a significant other or any attempt at a normal life.
Ever watch Farscape? John + Aeryn made a great show even better.
Quote:I agree Nick and Juliette had little chemistry as a romantic couple. Nick and Adalind had even less.
Less?! I think I'll have to disagree there.
RE: Eve/Juliette - brandon - 03-01-2018
Nick is not lied, only hide you about
" life GRIMM"- season 1-
Say about the Wesen was easy?
There are people who like the sadomasochism and...- and is not interested to say so that they see that they are sincere.
Someone is sincere with their partner or family 100%?
I not.
RE: Eve/Juliette - Hexenadler - 03-01-2018
(03-01-2018, 07:26 AM)Hell Rell Wrote: It also doesn't help that I've never been a fan of "love conquers all" storylines. It just makes the characters look absurd unless the show makes a point of showing how absurd they are. There were too many obstacles, danger, and lies for their relationship to last.
I think that has more to do with your personal cynicism than the concept itself.