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+---- Thread: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? (/Thread-Grimm-Is-Nick-Going-to-End-Up-Alone)
RE: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? - FaceInTheCrowd - 12-02-2018
The staff always had to respond to the thoughts of its bearer. Otherwise, Z would have had to bark commands at it anytime he wanted it to do something.
RE: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? - irukandji - 12-02-2018
(12-02-2018, 09:18 AM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: The staff always had to respond to the thoughts of its bearer. Otherwise, Z would have had to bark commands at it anytime he wanted it to do something.
I'm still not quite on board with this, but it would have to be something that would have to exist if the point of the ending resulted in Nick creating his own universe.
RE: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? - FaceInTheCrowd - 12-02-2018
I don't know how "subconscious" Nick's desires had to be. Wanting his friends alive and together, Z gone and all the people he killed restored and Bonaparte's ring off Adalind's finger (btw, I'm pretty sure the only reason for the business about the ring was to send the audience a signal that Nick wasn't just hallucinating the ending), none of these strike me as thoughts Nick wouldn't be aware of at that moment. But if the staff is thought-directed, one would hope it has the ability to distinguish between its owner's conscious and subconscious. Because most of us have some pretty scary things in our subconscious from time to time.
RE: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? - Henry of green - 12-02-2018
(12-02-2018, 11:16 AM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: I don't know how "subconscious" Nick's desires had to be. Wanting his friends alive and together, Z gone and all the people he killed restored and Bonaparte's ring off Adalind's finger (btw, I'm pretty sure the only reason for the business about the ring was to send the audience a signal that Nick wasn't just hallucinating the ending), none of these strike me as thoughts Nick wouldn't be aware of at that moment. But if the staff is thought-directed, one would hope it has the ability to distinguish between its owner's conscious and subconscious. Because most of us have some pretty scary things in our subconscious from time to time.
I agree the staff picked up on Nicks desire to have his friends back I think that’s what the most of us have been saying but the show also made it clear Nick didn’t know what the hell was happening at the time that’s why he fought being dragged into the portal and was so shocked in Monroe’s living room
I think the original pupurse of Adalind having the ring was so Nick could eventually remove it, but it’s clear they used that ring removing scene and Diana remember everything in the finale as a way of letting the audience of know everything that actually happend was real.
The believe or not the oddest things for me in that episode was Nick hugging all his friends after returning to the living room except Monroe that seemed quite weird.
Also I know Diana was under Zerstorers spell however the writers should have made that a little more obvious to all fans beacuse I heard quite a few reviewers complain about her nonchalant reactions to her perants death them not understanding she was under Zerstorers influence.
RE: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? - irukandji - 12-02-2018
(12-02-2018, 11:16 AM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: I don't know how "subconscious" Nick's desires had to be. Wanting his friends alive and together, Z gone and all the people he killed restored and Bonaparte's ring off Adalind's finger (btw, I'm pretty sure the only reason for the business about the ring was to send the audience a signal that Nick wasn't just hallucinating the ending), none of these strike me as thoughts Nick wouldn't be aware of at that moment. But if the staff is thought-directed, one would hope it has the ability to distinguish between its owner's conscious and subconscious. Because most of us have some pretty scary things in our subconscious from time to time.
Actually, what I would hope is that Nick would have the wisdom and the fortitude to leave his alternate universe alone and let the his friend develop according to their own wishes and not his.
RE: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? - FaceInTheCrowd - 12-02-2018
I sometimes think that directors need to record those DVD-type comments at the time a show of film is first shown so they can be run as a SAP.
I don't see Nick as the type of character who would be interested in changing the way his friends develop as people. What I do think he might do to excess if he became fully aware of the power he now apparently possesses is undo any bad thing that ever happens to them. And there are all sorts of stories that could be told about how that might go wrong.
RE: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? - irukandji - 12-02-2018
(12-02-2018, 12:10 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: I don't see Nick as the type of character who would be interested in changing the way his friends develop as people. What I do think he might do to excess if he became fully aware of the power he now apparently possesses is undo any bad thing that ever happens to them. And there are all sorts of stories that could be told about how that might go wrong.
While Grimm has never been a hard on science fiction series, it does have science fiction elements in it. I never figured it for an alternate universe episode but it decided to go this route and what's done is done. Nick has already made changes to the characters in the alternate universe. Right now they seem minor and perhaps they may continue that way. But the fact still remains. If you believe he created the vortex as a means of escaping the death and destruction around him in order to make a new world where he ends up happy and contented, is that a guarantee he'll stay happy and contented?
RE: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? - Hell Rell - 12-02-2018
(12-02-2018, 11:16 AM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: I don't know how "subconscious" Nick's desires had to be. Wanting his friends alive and together, Z gone and all the people he killed restored and Bonaparte's ring off Adalind's finger (btw, I'm pretty sure the only reason for the business about the ring was to send the audience a signal that Nick wasn't just hallucinating the ending), none of these strike me as thoughts Nick wouldn't be aware of at that moment. But if the staff is thought-directed, one would hope it has the ability to distinguish between its owner's conscious and subconscious. Because most of us have some pretty scary things in our subconscious from time to time.
I view it more as the staff picking up Nick's innermost desire. It gives him the thing he wants the most at the moment instead of just crafting every single thing he wants. That's why Bud's wife's pies didn't appear at the end although I consider that a plothole.
RE: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? - Henry of green - 12-02-2018
(12-02-2018, 12:27 PM)Hell Rell Wrote:(12-02-2018, 11:16 AM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: I don't know how "subconscious" Nick's desires had to be. Wanting his friends alive and together, Z gone and all the people he killed restored and Bonaparte's ring off Adalind's finger (btw, I'm pretty sure the only reason for the business about the ring was to send the audience a signal that Nick wasn't just hallucinating the ending), none of these strike me as thoughts Nick wouldn't be aware of at that moment. But if the staff is thought-directed, one would hope it has the ability to distinguish between its owner's conscious and subconscious. Because most of us have some pretty scary things in our subconscious from time to time.
I view it more as the staff picking up Nick's innermost desire. It gives him the thing he wants the most at the moment instead of just crafting every single thing he wants. That's why Bud's wife's pies didn't appear at the end although I consider that a plothole.
I agree
RE: Grimm: Is Nick Going to End Up Alone? - FaceInTheCrowd - 12-02-2018
(12-02-2018, 12:27 PM)irukandji Wrote: While Grimm has never been a hard on science fiction series, it does have science fiction elements in it. I never figured it for an alternate universe episode but it decided to go this route and what's done is done. Nick has already made changes to the characters in the alternate universe. Right now they seem minor and perhaps they may continue that way. But the fact still remains. If you believe he created the vortex as a means of escaping the death and destruction around him in order to make a new world where he ends up happy and contented, is that a guarantee he'll stay happy and contented?
If you take the episode literally, it's still the same universe, but changed. The idea that any change in time just creates another, alternate universe rather than changing the current one is common in science fiction, but nothing of the sort was ever suggested here.
You are entirely correct that the seemingly minor changes Nick made could balloon unpredictably. For example, suppose one of the two guys that Z killed in the gas station was originally going to commit a mass murder later that night?
Unless they decide to revisit this in the (hopefully) upcoming new series, we'll never know whether Nick ever develops enough control over the staff to deliberately cause these sorts of changes in reality or if it was only in the extreme emotional state he was in after losing just about everybody that he triggered whatever the staff did.
But I think it's a pretty safe bet that Z knew exactly how to use the staff to rewrite the universe at will once it had reabsorbed the stick.