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+--- Thread: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's (/Thread-Who-s-heinous-acts-were-worse-Adalind-s-or-Juliette-s)
RE: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's - dicappatore - 01-24-2018
(01-24-2018, 01:28 PM)New Guy Wrote:(01-24-2018, 12:55 PM)Henry of green Wrote: All isn’t yet to be discovered David made that statement just before the end of season 5 all has already been discovered, David, said Nick could forgive Juliette if it was Eve that got his mother killed and not regular Juliette, and what he means by Eve is Juliette’s hexenbiest.Hi Henry,
If Juliette, Hexenette and FrankenEve are the same person is that "person" guilty of murder?
From the restaurant scene:
Quote:Nick: You want to know what isn't easy? Knowing that you set me up... and that you set up my mother. What, are you gonna pretend like you don't remember?She uses first person "I" twice first as Eve then as Hexenette. In a later she episode refers to Juliette as someone else. It seems G&K were searching for a way to make the Eve character tolerable to the viewers that wanted justice for the murder of Kelly. IMO they failed. Juliette shall remain in infamy.
Eve: I remember everything. I would have killed you.
N G
Ha, you are quoting factual dialogue? HA, I say to you HA! Hey were those flying pigs wearing lipstick?
(01-24-2018, 10:10 AM)syscrash Wrote: If you think that is what was said then post the text. I posted the text to prove my point.
Like I said you have no idea what things she was referring to. She said for the things she did. Not all the things she did.
Yes she helped get Kelly to portland and to the house. But no one on the show accuses her of killing kelly. Nick only accuses Juliette of setting Kelly up not killing her. He accused Kenneth and the veratte but not Juliette. If I am wrong post the text.
A lot of bad things happened to me when all of this started.
I didn't understand it.
I was scared and angry, and I did a lot of terrible things.
Things I can never forgive Juliette for.
But I'm not Juliette anymore, Nick.
She's gone.
There may be a part of me that is like her, but it is not who I am now and it's not who I'm gonna be again.
I don't blame you.
When we were together, I only knew a part of who you were.
You only knew a part of who you were.
[solemn music] None of us are who we used to be.
And that's good.
You really believe we're all better off? I have a strength and a purpose that I never had before.
I know you're here because you loved me once, and you feel responsible for the bad things that have happened, but you can't change any of it.
And I can't change any of it.
And if you could, would you really want to go back to the way things were, just to be happy? Happy doesn't interest me anymore, Nick.
It just gets in the way.
[exhales] You know, everything that has happened to us, that brought us together right here, right now happened for a reason.
Gees, I wonder who said all of that. There are also references in there she is indirectly thanking him for her becoming a Hexenbiest. Can you pick out the lines?
RE: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's - New Guy - 01-24-2018
(01-24-2018, 02:21 PM)dicappatore Wrote:Here you go Dicap:(01-24-2018, 01:28 PM)New Guy Wrote:(01-24-2018, 12:55 PM)Henry of green Wrote: All isn’t yet to be discovered David made that statement just before the end of season 5 all has already been discovered, David, said Nick could forgive Juliette if it was Eve that got his mother killed and not regular Juliette, and what he means by Eve is Juliette’s hexenbiest.Hi Henry,
If Juliette, Hexenette and FrankenEve are the same person is that "person" guilty of murder?
From the restaurant scene:
Quote:Nick: You want to know what isn't easy? Knowing that you set me up... and that you set up my mother. What, are you gonna pretend like you don't remember?She uses first person "I" twice first as Eve then as Hexenette. In a later she episode refers to Juliette as someone else. It seems G&K were searching for a way to make the Eve character tolerable to the viewers that wanted justice for the murder of Kelly. IMO they failed. Juliette shall remain in infamy.
Eve: I remember everything. I would have killed you.
N G
Ha, you are quoting factual dialogue? HA, I say to you HA! Hey were those flying pigs wearing lipstick?
![[Image: lipstick-on-a-pig.jpg]](https://workbea.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/lipstick-on-a-pig.jpg)
Photographic evidence!
N G
RE: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's - dicappatore - 01-24-2018
(01-24-2018, 04:02 PM)New Guy Wrote:(01-24-2018, 02:21 PM)dicappatore Wrote:Here you go Dicap:(01-24-2018, 01:28 PM)New Guy Wrote:(01-24-2018, 12:55 PM)Henry of green Wrote: All isn’t yet to be discovered David made that statement just before the end of season 5 all has already been discovered, David, said Nick could forgive Juliette if it was Eve that got his mother killed and not regular Juliette, and what he means by Eve is Juliette’s hexenbiest.Hi Henry,
If Juliette, Hexenette and FrankenEve are the same person is that "person" guilty of murder?
From the restaurant scene:
Quote:Nick: You want to know what isn't easy? Knowing that you set me up... and that you set up my mother. What, are you gonna pretend like you don't remember?She uses first person "I" twice first as Eve then as Hexenette. In a later she episode refers to Juliette as someone else. It seems G&K were searching for a way to make the Eve character tolerable to the viewers that wanted justice for the murder of Kelly. IMO they failed. Juliette shall remain in infamy.
Eve: I remember everything. I would have killed you.
N G
Ha, you are quoting factual dialogue? HA, I say to you HA! Hey were those flying pigs wearing lipstick?
Photographic evidence!
N G
The Kermit in me sees a beauty'
RE: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's - irukandji - 01-26-2018
Recent pig dumbness aside, would both Juliette's and Adalind's backgrounds have played a role in their heinous crimes? Adalind was raised by her mother and while we know Juliette had a father, I recall reading somewhere about her being raised by a grandmother.
And both of these women made the dumbest mistake of their lives by picking the same man, (ugh) Nick. This is purely speculation, but did the women lead similar lives pre-Nick and what in those lives might have led to them to so easily committing murder?
RE: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's - brandon - 01-26-2018
It would be really stupid to say that because of the life they had before, they are like that.
But if I think that Adalind understood Nick better than juliette.
juliette that after becoming a "Hexenbiest", she said he could not understand it-silly and stupid woman-
To say that it was not juliette, but the "Hexenbiest" is not to see reality.
Juliette was tired of Nick and his group-very angry for the change and teh rest-,but they could not know because they could not read the mind,so juliette did all of that out of hatred
RE: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's - Hell Rell - 01-26-2018
I got the feeling that Adalind was in an emotionally abusive relationship with her mom, which combined with having no dad, constantly tried to win her approval and she became emotionally dependent on the men in her life. She was always trying to win someone's approval. I don't think Juliette had that kind of upbringing. She probably had some sort of ideal life which made her even more unprepared for the wesen world.
RE: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's - brandon - 01-27-2018
In the case of juliette, I would say that it has nothing to do with how to relate to "Wesen",juliette had a perfect life where nothing bad happened to her-I do not count on your grandmother's death because it's normal in everyone's life for that to happen-,
This change happened to him and she did not know how to take it, reject that.
Parents teach good deeds and do not expect money in return-juliette did not understand,instead Nick and Adalind know it, that worse things happen,because of their life experiences.
Believe that Adalind told him to be about his first look at the "GRIMM"?-season chapter 1-
I think not, why, but why send it if he knew it was a "Hexenbiest".
She wanted to get the key to Nick by Sean.
yes, juliette very independent but so was looking for Nick to kiss her like "Hexenbiest"
RE: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's - Robyn - 01-27-2018
Interesting question, irukandji, and thanks for getting the conversation back on track.
I always considered Adalind the product/victim of her mother’s upbringing as apposed to a ‘bad guy’ character driven by independent aspirations. As Hell Rell said, Adalind was always dependent on and in need of someone’s approval. First her mother and Renard, then Nick and his friends, even giving in to her old boss’ expectations of her although desperate for Nick to see her as a woman and mother rather than a Hexenbiest.
Then there’s Juliette, which I know less about probably because I gave less attention to her storyline, and Nick’s for that matter. I don’t know why Juliette lived with her grandmother, but I don’t recall anything about her growing up in an unhappy/unhealthy environment, so I’ll focus on her current timeline instead.
That Juliette and Adalind switching good guy bad guy places was rushed to fit within the finale timeframe makes understanding Juliette’s transition more difficult. However, there was sufficient reference to her being overwhelmed and confused by the horrific change in her life.
To me, Juliette becoming a Hexenbiest was learning about the Grimm/Wesen world times a thousand. There simply wasn’t logical reasoning for her to call on to make sense out of what was happening. Reaching out to Renard certainly made the situation worse, and really, I think Juliette’s conversation with Henrietta was more damaging than helpful. Plus, the show had Adalind refer to the Hexenbiest’s overpowering control. If Adalind was intimidated and fearful of the Hexenbiest influence, Juliette hardly stood a chance at resisting it.
And, the show ‘killing off’ Juliette denied viewers the opportunity to later understand her emotional struggle from Juliette’s point of view. Instead, we were forced to settle for Eve’s point of view of Juliette’s emotional struggle during S4.
RE: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's - irukandji - 01-27-2018
Thanks, Robyn. We don't know anything about Juliette's past and that has always been a pet peeve of mine about the series.
A question on my mind when I was thinking about this topic is, what trigger causes women like Adalind and Juliette to murder? Adalind's relationship with her mother was not a happy one, but I don't see that as the overwhelming trigger in her brain that rationalized her murder of Marie. I know she was doing it because Renard told her to, but what brought her to that point?
As for Juliette, we don't know a lot about her background, so it's even more questionable to me as to why someone like her would be so amendable to murder as well.
RE: Who's heinous acts were worse, Adalind's or Juliette's - syscrash - 01-27-2018
Quote:Thanks, Robyn. We don't know anything about Juliette's past and that has always been a pet peeve of mine about the series.Adalind and Eve like all wesen live by a different set of rules. they have a different out look on life. The common theme I have seen over six year is wesen live and breath the idea of survival of the fittest. You are either predator or prey. If you try and view Adalind , Eve , or any wesen from a human point of view. They would be classified as psychotic killing machines. Consider Rosalee chomped down and ripped the guys throat out. Yet she saw nothing wrong with that. How would that not have a human labeled as psychotic. Take Hank and Wu each time they shoot someone they hesitate. Name one wesen that hesitated before a kill or had second thoughts or showed regret afterward.
A question on my mind when I was thinking about this topic is, what trigger causes women like Adalind and Juliette to murder? Adalind's relationship with her mother was not a happy one, but I don't see that as the overwhelming trigger in her brain that rationalized her murder of Marie. I know she was doing it because Renard told her to, but what brought her to that point?
As for Juliette, we don't know a lot about her background, so it's even more questionable to me as to why someone like her would be so amendable to murder as well.