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+--- Thread: Difference between Nick's two relationships (/Thread-Difference-between-Nick-s-two-relationships)
RE: Difference between Nick's two relationships - Robyn - 10-22-2017
(10-22-2017, 08:13 AM)Henry of green Wrote: Robyn personally I never saw Adalind as being that attracted to Miesner I think he was more attracted to her than she was to him .I mean all she ever give him was a chaste kiss on the check but I think she thought of him more as a friend who helped her at her most vulnerable.
My inclusion of Meisner wasn’t based on their interaction in the official storyline, but rather:
Quote:...and also speculated that had Adalind’s storyline kept her with Meisner she would have fallen in love with him.
When Meisner put Adalind on the plane she was grateful to a man who had done what he promised to do - keep her and the baby safe. But had the storyline instead kept them on the run and in hiding for a longer period of time, Meisner/Adalind had the same potential as Nick/Adalind.
RE: Difference between Nick's two relationships - irukandji - 10-22-2017
(10-22-2017, 07:57 AM)Robyn Wrote: Unlike her previous relationship with Renard, Nick didn’t expect anything from Adalind - other than for her to be a loving mother to his son.
It would have been nice if Nick had taken just a few minutes to tell Adalind exactly what she was doing in his place. I can recall the episode when they went to the fome and drove inside the garage. Adalind seemed very uncomfortable because it was apparent she had no knowledge of Nick's plans.
I wanted to ask a question here because it seems to me that Adalind's capacity to love and to hate really surfaced when she became human and then reverted back to a hexenbiest. I am wondering if the complex Adalind we saw in the last seasons of Grimm occurred because she had been human for a time.
RE: Difference between Nick's two relationships - Robyn - 10-22-2017
(10-22-2017, 08:35 AM)Henry of green Wrote: I agree and I think nick and Miesner are quite similar personality wise and are generally more kind hearted than Renard.I think Nick and Meisner could afford to be more kind hearted because of the relationships they each established with their allies who were also friends.
In contrast, Renard only had strategically placed allies and paid mercenaries. He may have cared for some more than others, he was visibly shaken by Meisner's horrific death, but in the end, any friendship/loyalty they might have shared wasn't strong enough to deter Renard from his personal goals.
RE: Difference between Nick's two relationships - Robyn - 10-22-2017
(10-22-2017, 08:34 AM)irukandji Wrote: It would have been nice if Nick had taken just a few minutes to tell Adalind exactly what she was doing in his place. I can recall the episode when they went to the fome and drove inside the garage. Adalind seemed very uncomfortable because it was apparent she had no knowledge of Nick's plans.Adalind knew Nick sold the house because he found a safer place for them, but yes, Adalind obviously assumed they were moving to a typical house in a safer location because Nick didn’t bother to tell her he was making a paint factory habitable for them.
(10-22-2017, 08:34 AM)irukandji Wrote: I wanted to ask a question here because it seems to me that Adalind's capacity to love and to hate really surfaced when she became human and then reverted back to a hexenbiest. I am wondering if the complex Adalind we saw in the last seasons of Grimm occurred because she had been human for a time.I’m not sure I see the S5 & S6 Adalind as complex. To me, Adalind’s time as human didn’t initiate any change in her behavior or mindset. And actually, I found Adalind at her most cruel while human and choosing to birth a baby to barter for a Hexenbiest.
Had G & K continued with the show’s underlying storyline of Grimm vs. Royals battle for the keys, compounded by the new storylines of the super power child with a potential for great good or great evil and Hexenbiest Juliette, the show could have explored the complex evolution of Nick, Adalind, and their relationship. Not only would it have brought the Royals/Keys storyline to a plausible conclusion, it might have been a rip-roaring ride for viewers to watch Nick and Adalind struggle against their string of ill-fated assumptions and bad choices, ultimately winning that struggle in the end.
RE: Difference between Nick's two relationships - Henry of green - 10-22-2017
I agree Adalind was at her most vile in season 2 when she was human planning to sell her own baby and she was human at the time. Adalind is one of my two Favorite characters but this storyline made me hate her at the time ,I wanted to jump into the screen and give her a slap to wise her up.
RE: Difference between Nick's two relationships - irukandji - 10-22-2017
(10-22-2017, 09:36 AM)Robyn Wrote: I’m not sure I see the S5 & S6 Adalind as complex. To me, Adalind’s time as human didn’t initiate any change in her behavior or mindset. And actually, I found Adalind at her most cruel while human and choosing to birth a baby to barter for a Hexenbiest.
I'll try and put it this way because my statement was not worded well. As I said before, I know a lot of women who were bitches before motherhood and bitches after motherhood, even though they are spectacular mothers. So, to me, the fact that Adalind became a mother doesn't contribute a lot to the new and improved Adalind as far as a good woman goes. What I was wondering though, did the time she spent as a human contribute to her growth as a good woman?
As you said, the first time she was human, she was vindictive and cruel. She also threatened to abort her baby if she didn't get her way. However, I was thinking about what she had learned as a human. She learned firsthand about cruelty as a human would.
The next time she was human was when she took the suppression potion. During that time she learned about many of the good things of being human, companionship, trust, regret, etc.
While there isn't a lot of complexity shown in any of the characters in season 6, the propensity to show regret is the only that Adalind, out of all of the characters, openly demonstrated to both Nick (as a human) and moreso, to Eve (when she was a hexenbiest).
RE: Difference between Nick's two relationships - Henry of green - 10-22-2017
(10-22-2017, 09:49 AM)irukandji Wrote:(10-22-2017, 09:36 AM)Robyn Wrote: I’m not sure I see the S5 & S6 Adalind as complex. To me, Adalind’s time as human didn’t initiate any change in her behavior or mindset. And actually, I found Adalind at her most cruel while human and choosing to birth a baby to barter for a Hexenbiest.
I'll try and put it this way because my statement was not worded well. As I said before, I know a lot of women who were bitches before motherhood and bitches after motherhood, even though they are spectacular mothers. So, to me, the fact that Adalind became a mother doesn't contribute a lot to the new and improved Adalind as far as a good woman goes. What I was wondering though, did the time she spent as a human contribute to her growth as a good woman?
As you said, the first time she was human, she was vindictive and cruel. She also threatened to abort her baby if she didn't get her way. However, I was thinking about what she had learned as a human. She learned firsthand about cruelty as a human would.
The next time she was human was when she took the suppression potion. During that time she learned about many of the good things of being human, companionship, trust, regret, etc.
While there isn't a lot of complexity shown in any of the characters in season 6, the propensity to show regret is the only that Adalind, out of all of the characters, openly demonstrated to both Nick (as a human) and moreso, to Eve (when she was a hexenbiest).
Completely agree great post ,Irk.
RE: Difference between Nick's two relationships - irukandji - 10-22-2017
(10-22-2017, 09:54 AM)Henry of green Wrote:(10-22-2017, 09:49 AM)irukandji Wrote:(10-22-2017, 09:36 AM)Robyn Wrote: I’m not sure I see the S5 & S6 Adalind as complex. To me, Adalind’s time as human didn’t initiate any change in her behavior or mindset. And actually, I found Adalind at her most cruel while human and choosing to birth a baby to barter for a Hexenbiest.
I'll try and put it this way because my statement was not worded well. As I said before, I know a lot of women who were bitches before motherhood and bitches after motherhood, even though they are spectacular mothers. So, to me, the fact that Adalind became a mother doesn't contribute a lot to the new and improved Adalind as far as a good woman goes. What I was wondering though, did the time she spent as a human contribute to her growth as a good woman?
As you said, the first time she was human, she was vindictive and cruel. She also threatened to abort her baby if she didn't get her way. However, I was thinking about what she had learned as a human. She learned firsthand about cruelty as a human would.
The next time she was human was when she took the suppression potion. During that time she learned about many of the good things of being human, companionship, trust, regret, etc.
While there isn't a lot of complexity shown in any of the characters in season 6, the propensity to show regret is the only that Adalind, out of all of the characters, openly demonstrated to both Nick (as a human) and moreso, to Eve (when she was a hexenbiest).
Completely agree great post ,Irk.
Thank you, Henry!
RE: Difference between Nick's two relationships - Robyn - 10-22-2017
(10-22-2017, 09:49 AM)irukandji Wrote:Okay, I’m completely on board with that analogy. I always felt Adalind’s desperation to get her powers back was more likely motivated by fear than simply wanting to return to a form she was familiar with or even for the benefit of getting revenge.(10-22-2017, 09:36 AM)Robyn Wrote: I’m not sure I see the S5 & S6 Adalind as complex. To me, Adalind’s time as human didn’t initiate any change in her behavior or mindset. And actually, I found Adalind at her most cruel while human and choosing to birth a baby to barter for a Hexenbiest.
I'll try and put it this way because my statement was not worded well. As I said before, I know a lot of women who were bitches before motherhood and bitches after motherhood, even though they are spectacular mothers. So, to me, the fact that Adalind became a mother doesn't contribute a lot to the new and improved Adalind as far as a good woman goes. What I was wondering though, did the time she spent as a human contribute to her growth as a good woman?
As you said, the first time she was human, she was vindictive and cruel. She also threatened to abort her baby if she didn't get her way. However, I was thinking about what she had learned as a human. She learned firsthand about cruelty as a human would.
The next time she was human was when she took the suppression potion. During that time she learned about many of the good things of being human, companionship, trust, regret, etc.
While there isn't a lot of complexity shown in any of the characters in season 6, the propensity to show regret is the only that Adalind, out of all of the characters, openly demonstrated to both Nick (as a human) and moreso, to Eve (when she was a hexenbiest).
So yea, it makes perfect sense that Adalind learned first hand what it was like to be a vulnerable human pitted against a powerful entity such as a Hexenbiest. And to also know what it was like for that powerful entity to be driven by revenge that she caused. In that respect, Adalind and Juliette understand how it feels on both sides of the controversy.
And you’re right, within the so-called evolution of Adalind and Nick/Adalind, she was the only character to express regret over her actions. Which to me, made Nick’s silence to the kidnapping’s blowback and Adalind’s obvious commitment to her children even more deafening.
RE: Difference between Nick's two relationships - rpmaluki - 10-22-2017
(10-22-2017, 07:04 AM)Robyn Wrote: I know the show attributed Adalind’s progression from bad to good to Nick, but for me, Adalind becoming a mother set her on that path.I'm not 100% sure about this, due to to the dialogue from Adalind at the end of S4, Nick telling Monroe she was a great mother, Adalind leaving Nick, yes she was head over heels by then but he wasn't the biggest motivator for her change, just the biggest beneficiary.