+- Grimm Forum (https://grimmforum.com/forum)
+-- Forum: Grimm Universe (https://grimmforum.com/forum/Forum-Grimm-Universe)
+--- Forum: Spoilers (https://grimmforum.com/forum/Forum-Spoilers)
+---- Forum: Season 5 Spoilers (https://grimmforum.com/forum/Forum-Season-5-Spoilers)
+---- Thread: Why is Renard even a captain? (/Thread-Why-is-Renard-even-a-captain)
Pages:
1
2
Why is Renard even a captain? - Zauberbiest - 05-14-2016
So in last night's episode, Renard says that he joined Black Claw because:
"The Kehrseite (humans) have had this world for too long, and they've ruined it. Our world will be more violent, more primitive, but that is the only way to true progress. It's time for the Wesen to come out of the shadows, Nick, and they're going to. Believe me.This is a revolution, and revolutions are forged in blood."
Has he always believed in this notion or just changed his philosophy recently? He has spent years keeping the wesen and human world in order and crimes in check. Now, he suddenly wants the world to be more "violent and primitive," and ultimately tossing away everything he once stood for. Why the sudden change? For someone to radically change their beliefs from keeping order in the city to causing total chaos in just a few weeks is very odd and unhealthy.
RE: Why is Renard even a captain? - izzy - 05-14-2016
(05-14-2016, 05:26 PM)Zauberbiest Wrote: ... and ultimately tossing away everything he once stood for. Why the sudden change? For someone to radically change their beliefs from keeping order in the city to causing total chaos in just a few weeks is very odd and unhealthy.
The show aside, in real life, it is not uncommon. You can look at political candidates for example, religious leaders, and 1st or 2nd generation inheritors of systems (religions, fighting methods, philosophy).
In order not to bring the forum down in flames, I have selected what I hope by now is a rather benign example: Barry Goldwater. Many would state that the Goldwater who ran against Johnson was the antithesis of Goldwater of the 1990s.
Kindest regards,
Izod
RE: Why is Renard even a captain? - syscrash - 05-14-2016
Quote:Has he always believed in this notion or just changed his philosophy recently? He has spent years keeping the wesen and human world in order and crimes in check. Now, he suddenly wants the world to be more "violent and primitive," and ultimately tossing away everything he once stood for. Why the sudden change? For someone to radically change their beliefs from keeping order in the city to causing total chaos in just a few weeks is very odd and unhealthy.
Sean has always lived by a set of "violent and primitive" rules. You took my Grimm I take your life. And this was his brother he had killed violently. How much more primitive and violent can you get. So why would it be hard to see Sean wanting a world where he would not have to hide his actions.
For that matter, why would Nick not want to be able to go after wesen committing crimes he could never prosecute.
I do see Sean and Nick finding common ground. Sean did say he needs Nick to help control the blood shed. Since Sean can't be captain make Nick captain. He is in charge of wesen affairs. Make Wu a detective and Hank new partner. Now Nick will be able to be a Grimm and like his aunt said track down the bad ones.
RE: Why is Renard even a captain? - Kathryn Wooten - 05-14-2016
(05-14-2016, 06:39 PM)syscrash Wrote:Sean is still capt until Jan 1stQuote:Has he always believed in this notion or just changed his philosophy recently? He has spent years keeping the wesen and human world in order and crimes in check. Now, he suddenly wants the world to be more "violent and primitive," and ultimately tossing away everything he once stood for. Why the sudden change? For someone to radically change their beliefs from keeping order in the city to causing total chaos in just a few weeks is very odd and unhealthy.
Sean has always lived by a set of "violent and primitive" rules. You took my Grimm I take your life. And this was his brother he had killed violently. How much more primitive and violent can you get. So why would it be hard to see Sean wanting a world where he would not have to hide his actions.
For that matter, why would Nick not want to be able to go after wesen committing crimes he could never prosecute.
I do see Sean and Nick finding common ground. Sean did say he needs Nick to help control the blood shed. Since Sean can't be captain make Nick captain. He is in charge of wesen affairs. Make Wu a detective and Hank new partner. Now Nick will be able to be a Grimm and like his aunt said track down the bad ones.
RE: Why is Renard even a captain? - FaceInTheCrowd - 05-14-2016
(05-14-2016, 05:26 PM)Zauberbiest Wrote: Has he always believed in this notion or just changed his philosophy recently?
I'm still on the fence as to whether he really means it or is just putting on an act for Bonaparte.
RE: Why is Renard even a captain? - Zauberbiest - 05-15-2016
I think Renard is the one that dies in the finale. He is too fixed on the goals and ambition of BC. He is a lost cause. I wonder how his all powerful time-stopping mother would react when she finds out he's dead.
RE: Why is Renard even a captain? - FaceInTheCrowd - 05-15-2016
If it is Renard who dies, he could be killed fighting for BC, or it could turn out that he's not really drunk the kool aid and BC kills him when they find out.
And if it did happen, would Elizabeth be more upset that he's dead, or with whatever side he ended up choosing?
RE: Why is Renard even a captain? - Rotkäppchen - 05-15-2016
(05-14-2016, 08:01 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote:(05-14-2016, 05:26 PM)Zauberbiest Wrote: Has he always believed in this notion or just changed his philosophy recently?
I'm still on the fence as to whether he really means it or is just putting on an act for Bonaparte.
I sort of felt that way too especially after watching Sasha, David and Bitsie at that last Wizard Con interview thing ... or at least (again) leaving us with a finale that has you going OMG IS HE DEAD? IS HE REALLY DEAD THIS TIME or is it Nick that's dead or one of or both of them? As in both go in and you don't see either come out or one come out ... sometimes bodies are found sometimes not and how that plays into S6
RE: Why is Renard even a captain? - Kathryn Wooten - 05-19-2016
(05-15-2016, 04:13 PM)Zauberbiest Wrote: I think Renard is the one that dies in the finale. He is too fixed on the goals and ambition of BC. He is a lost cause. I wonder how his all powerful time-stopping mother would react when she finds out he's dead.
Bitsie said beloved character dies....and from what I read here about Renard through the past 2 seasons...lol he is not beloved so he is not the one (he is safe) besides it will seem.....that Renard will not be shown with the scoobie gang...at the comic -con Sasha admit he did not see the ending of the finale......but David hinted what will happen and he knew and Sasha moved his body like something he's doing would be fun .........
RE: Why is Renard even a captain? - jsgrimm45 - 05-19-2016
(05-14-2016, 05:26 PM)Zauberbiest Wrote: So in last night's episode, Renard says that he joined Black Claw because:If you watched Babylon 5 the first ones left to help the younger races were in totally different camps that is how I seen that statement of Renard a storyline somewhat the same. First he is a Vorlon now he with the Shadows.
"The Kehrseite (humans) have had this world for too long, and they've ruined it. Our world will be more violent, more primitive, but that is the only way to true progress. It's time for the Wesen to come out of the shadows, Nick, and they're going to. Believe me.This is a revolution, and revolutions are forged in blood."
Has he always believed in this notion or just changed his philosophy recently? He has spent years keeping the wesen and human world in order and crimes in check. Now, he suddenly wants the world to be more "violent and primitive," and ultimately tossing away everything he once stood for. Why the sudden change? For someone to radically change their beliefs from keeping order in the city to causing total chaos in just a few weeks is very odd and unhealthy.
